Monday, October 17, 2016

Dream: Horses Feet

It happened again. This time I actually lucid dreamed out of 4 times in my entire life.

So, instead of the Daycare, in the dream, I was working on a commission for this family with two little daughters. They let me stay over while I worked on it and the dream starts with me getting up in the morning and doing my usual phone update and internet bullshitting over breakfast. I was reading some posts in a conversation and wanted to finish them but the mother of the family, who looked like a brown haired Cara Buono(basically Mike Wheeler's mom from Stranger Things), told me to get to work soon. She wasn't mean about it but I did get the sense that I didn't want to sit around for too long bullshitting in front of her because that might look unproductive and unprofessional.

So, I told her I would and took my phone with me into the other room to finish reading the text conversation. The two girls of the house were playing in the other room and spoke to me but I don't remember what they said. In the kitchen again, the husband of the family who looked a little like Steven Crowder, had a few big pieces of paper that he and his wife were inspecting together. They looked like diagrams of a horse, anatomically stripped down and seen from above or below but they were acting like these were X-rays. They marked one of the feet on these diagrams as a "problem" to fix and nodded in agreement with go-get 'em optimism.

Next, I'm back in the other room getting my paints ready and I see through the doorway into the kitchen which is now separated by a screen door, the husband and wife bring in a horse through the kitchen and crossing through another doorway that led to a different, unseen room. The horse had a severe limp, like its left front leg was broken at the ankle and it was just dangling like the loose end of a sock as it walked through the kitchen. I remember thinking how nurturing and just generally cool the couple were, overwhelmed with their love for this wounded animal as the husband cradled its face in his hands and coached it to follow him, walking before it backwards into the unseen room, and the wife helping keep the horse steady as she walked beside it, also cooing words of love and encouragement.

The turning point happened when they were gone into the other room and I looked at the floor and saw horses feet, cut off from the ankle, sitting in bloody smears and puddles on the kitchen floor, like slippers that had come off its feet as it made this trek across the kitchen. They still stood upright, about 4 or 5 of them and I thought that was weird. Then the husband and wife were coming back, directing the horse back through the kitchen towards the outside door. This time however, the entire front of the horse was gone, like part of a video cut out, and it was leaving feet behind again, pulling full footed legs from decapitated feet it left sitting upright on the floor as it walked. And the back end of the horse moved as if it was normal, like there was nothing amiss with the front end. That's when I became aware that I was dreaming.

Excited and very fond of the couple that had taken me in for a commission, I bit my lip and opened the  screen door, approaching the wife who stood at the counter making something while her husband dealt with the disembodied horse. I told her, "This is my dream. I'm dreaming." and there was this slight lisp to my voice, a very vague difficulty speaking. I had her attention and I asked her, "What part of me do you represent?" because I was interested and wanted to hear what this inner part of me had to say. She didn't deny it at all and in fact wasn't surprised, talking as if we were picking up from a conversation we'd already been having, saying, "We're your desire."

I kick myself now because she continued to talk and I heard some of it but my panic began right around then as her voice started to fade out, so, now, I don't remember any of it. After her voice started to fade out, she began to grow smaller, as if pulled away from me, and the visage of a cat was close, right up against my face on the left hand side. I apologized to her, shouted that I loved her and thanked her but I couldn't hear her. She did not seem angry before I awoke. Seems whatever she had to tell me, I was a little scared to hear subconsciously. It might be worth it to find her again now that I'm conscious and listen to her message.

Wednesday, October 12, 2016

Daycare Murals: Week Two!

Wow! It's been a long two days! But I think I have captured the essence of my mode of production, the perfect pattern for getting this done. I didn't drink any caffeine all weekend and let myself nap whenever I felt tired. Then up early Monday and Tuesday, doing the 13 hour shifts each and drinking an energy drink/day. They actually last if I let myself only take a sip each hour. Now, I don't work on it again until next Tuesday. So, I've got time to let the caffeine leave my system, catch up on sleep and relax. And don't you worry! I originally worried about not having enough time, right? Pffft. With this system in place and the airy, high feeling I get in those early mornings alone, this stuff goes on the wall without a fight. It helps that it's a cartoon so the details can be flatly shaded. I've been told though that what I'm doing is not flat at all. But anyway, I anticipate needing 2 more days on it, at the most 4, which, if I do 2 days a week, should be done within the month. No problem!

Here's Bruce, the shark. He is a lot lighter blue in the picture, my eye interpreting the colors as being lighter than they were while progressively mixing the black into it. However, I'm okay with him not being perfect because I think it looks more dramatic and everybody fucking loves the shark. I've been told several times that it looks like he's coming out of the wall.

Next are the turtles. I was using one container to mix the paint and just slowly working through the rainbow with it. I changed it though when I moved onto the yellow and orange because it would not come back from being dark green. I would have used up more paint trying to change the color.

These guys were fairly easy. Lots of little folds in the eyes and they have spots on them that'll go on when I do the brown. The order I'm going in was ROYGBIV for the container reasons. But like I said, I ended up throwing out the green after the turtles and I'm going to redo Dory's blue since she was the opposite of everyone else. With these guys, I started from light, almost white color, and progressively made the tone and shade darker. For Dory, I started with the deep blue of her stomach and tried to go lighter. As a result, she looks flat compared to everyone else and her color blue isn't even her color. But yeah, after orange, I'm doing pink and then purple, and then moving on to brown. Then I'll go back in and add touch up with the black, fill in eye colors, things like that. Then finally, very last thing will be white, which will include shades of white because the eyes and stuff have shadows on them.

So, for right now, Squirt's eyes are messed up and he looks a little cross-eyed but that'll change in the final when I'm able to go in with the white. I just didn't want to have to be careful about the white or take the white back out after because I knew, painting around the eyes, sometimes it'd encroach too much on the space of the eye, like with Squirt's eyelids. He's the smallest face on this thing and you can see the texture on the wall. It makes it super hard to take a small brush and get the fine details, so, the white will help later to clear up his expression. Everybody things he's adorable though, so, not sure why I'm over explaining.

Here's a pic of me yesterday morning standing with my creation.

The yellow of Dory's tail and markings. Yesterday, I was retarded and forgot to bring the ipad I've been sing. So, I had to look at the dinky little screen on my phone. Still, I think it turned out alright. It'll really pop when I change the blue.

Because of the issues with the pics yesterday, I got tired super fast and lost steam right around 2 pm when I still had the orange to do. I ran out of time by 7 when I had to clean up and leave, so, the orange is not done yet. Already, though, you can see the dramatic shading going on. I have two shades darker to go with it. A more reddish orange and then an almost black orange to fill in the really dark shadows. He no longer looks like Don Knotts, thank God! XD

 Seaweed and coral accents. Because of the order of colors I'm doing, these came in between the paintings of the figures, using the same and similar colors. The coral will all probably look pretty flat because they're not as important.

And that's all until next week! I have some coral to do and then the brown of the turtle's shells and fins. THAT will be a day. But I'm excited! After that, remixing the blue for Dory and then the black and white. Some accent bubbles in the water. Then signing my name by the light sockets and DONE!

Saturday, October 8, 2016

Daycare Murals: Week One

There's this strange serenity that comes over you when you only get 3 hours of sleep after a 16 hour stretch. I found my zen today returning to the Daycare murals.

Lemme back up because I am jumping ahead a little bit. So, original plan was to do Finding Nemo for one wall and Lilo & Stitch for the other. After I posted the pics of Dory, Marlin, and Nemo on FB, someone asked "Where's Bruce and Crush?" Long story short, my boss, Mimi, liked that idea and wanted me to do those instead of Lilo & Stitch. Me, being the challenge junkie I am, salivating over the prospect of painting a shark and the detail of the sea turtle's shell, agreed. Because I'm psychotic and masochistic. XD

 On Thursday, I stayed from 6-7 in order to get as much done as possible. But, as usually happens before a project day, I couldn't fall asleep. Got up, went in, got my energy drink on, put on my playlist, and tackled Bruce the shark. I dissociated so much during the drawing stage and I sang most of the time, only realizing when people showed up at 11-noon, that I was halfway through painting the lineart. Barely any mistakes, barely any erasing. Brought a shit ton of pencils this time and better charcoal and just mentally escaped, floating in a surreal awareness while I drew. I find God in these moments.

 The wall behind them is going to be plain blue, maybe some bubbles here and there, and in the corners, some seaweed and coral in both pics. Mimi wasn't comfortable painting the wall or getting close to the lineart, so, she asked me to painted a buffer for her. That's what this is. And that's the color blue it'll be.

 Base coat for Dory. I didn't realize I'd need to apply a base but taking the blue to the wall, it turned out to be too dark for her, for one thing, but for another, the white showed through too much. So, I'm going to lighten it and smooth it out for the next layer. Then there will be a final layer with the highlights after that.

 Mimi has confirmed that these are just donations, so, that's what they are. I feel serene and content about that too. It would be nice to get paid but then she's talking about after they open, bringing me back to do other walls and paying me for those.

 The blue was so hard to get right. The blue from the last picture was straight out of the can and it was way too dark, it didn't provide enough contrast with the black parts of her. But adding white to it seemed to make it faded rather than bright. So, I tried adding a tiny bit of yellow to make it greenish. It made it a gray, sea green. So, I added more blue back into it and added red. The fire truck red I have is insane. It is the type of color that you add it to something and suddenly it is fucking RED. So, I dripped it little by little, mixing after each time until I got the right purple consistency. But adding the blue and red made it dark again. So, I added white and it again faded it somewhat. I'm still not completely happy with the color and in the future, when I do kid's rooms again, I might order colors online from this brand. Because the local shops do not have anything but the main colors. 1 blue, 1 red, 1 green, 1 yellow, you know?

After I had the basic color down, I just added white to it to get the different grades of lighting. It's not perfect but it elevated it beyond the flatness before. Each time I stopped to mix, because she is so large and because of that rough texture on the wall, by the time I went to apply the next level of light, what I'd put down before had dried. So, I think this will end up being true for the entire rest of the thing. Which isn't a big deal because it still looks fine. But I would have preferred to make the progression of shades smoother.

Tuesday, October 4, 2016

Daycare Murals: Day One!

So, hah! Something happened because I'm a ridiculous human being! A daycare in the area closed down and this lady I go to church with is reopening it this November. Well, when she's at church, she mentions in class that they're gonna be painting the walls because they're all ugly white. She even said "murals." It was my literal second time going back to church after an 8 year absence and I felt Jesus lifting my hand in the air. Only when I had attention did I realize and was all, "Hey! How'd that get up there??? ^^; " Long story short, I offered to do 2 murals for the daycare and if she doesn't offer to pay me, then we'll just consider this one for JC. He's got a plan or somethin'...

 So, today was my first time going to work on it and it is an hour drive from where I live so, I'm carpooling to save gas. Except the people I carpool with have to be over in that area at 6 a.m. every morning. ...Which means we leave at 5. ...Which means...I get up at 4 to get ready. It wasn't too bad, although I feel intense and numb right now in a weird combination that only a fading energy drink and fatigue can recreate. I'm a dumb piece of shit too. I packed 2 pencils(notably unreliable brand), 3 charcoal pencils, 3 fine point Sharpies, and paint cans. No tarp for the floor. No paint thinner(which can help with mixing the paints, cleaning the brushes, and keeping the paint wet while I work with it). The plastic baggies I brought were too small. The pencils kept on breaking when sharpened, including the charcoal which ended up being a LOT more crumbly than predicted. I almost didn't finish drawing the details I needed because I wore through both pencils and one of the charcoals. The sharpies didn't work because the wall is very textured and ate the shit out of the tips. So, because of my genius prep, not only did I not paint today but I only finished the linework for one of the murals. Great start, Manders. Good job.

 Here's the pencilwork for the first mural, Finding Nemo themed. It's all free handed from a pic I got off Google and looked at on an ipad that kept wanting to go to sleep. You can see all my mistake lines still where I tried to erase. It's why we decided not to paint the background yet.

Here's the linework done. I had to use black paint for it since the sharpies suicided. There's a lot of lines here that are just for me to guide my while painting to know where muscles and cheeks are. So, I know Marlin looks kinda like a Don Knotts caricature right now but that'll change once he's orange and shit. My ride was scheduled to pick me up at noon and it was 11:54 when I decided to go ahead and fill in the black of Dory's designs. Did not finish it in time. Doesn't matter because when I go to actually paint that area, it's mixed with speckles of blue near her dorsal fin and will need to be mixed and everything anyway. I just thought it would look nice for a picture.

So, yeah. This is my first mural of the season and it needs to be finished by the end of October. In addition to another one on the wall right next to it. All before the daycare opens. What am I doing? Am I going to die? @,,,@;

Sunday, October 2, 2016

Part 2 of EoP started!

Ahhhh. Sorry. This is horrible upkeep, I know. But it turns out, I can't do analysis type blog posts and write creatively at the same time. I either think about things in a "tear it apart" type way or I get into "storymode" and the two are supremely incompatible. So, sorry, for those who follow this blog or keep up with it at all. I promised a lot and delivered none of it. But no news is good news because now, I've come to tell you that the first book of EoP is finished! At least the draft is. I'm now working on part 2, which is also being posted to FictionPress under the title Witchy Witch, In My Head .

Yeah! Blood effects GIMP style! I'm having a lot of fun with this new story and now I feel confident enough that I can pretty much write anything on my own now. So, that's a plus!

One thing worth mentioning is that I also can't write creatively and paint at the same time...but I'm gonna try. I have some new commissions I'm working on this month and it's a tight deadline so I'm going to be working my fucking ass off to get them done. And in between painting days, I'm going to try writing. We'll see how it goes. Either way, my production is going to slow way, way down. *tear*

Sorry this has gone way on the back burner. Even when EoP is completely done, I hope to just keep moving on to new projects. This marketing business is too troublesome and I realize that people don't like me, lol. So, fuck it. I'll paint and write and if you read, that's great but I'm not going out of my way to advertise. It goes against my nature.

Saturday, September 3, 2016

Summer is Over! Time to Art!

I took a break from art commissions this summer because it was way too hot to paint. My paints kept drying too much to work with and apparently, people don't like it when you get naked while painting for them, so, I had to wait for cooler weather. So, I've been collecting commissions since May of stuff people have approached me to work on.

Currently(in no particular order):

1. Family Tree (living room wall)
2. Apple Orchard (panel)
3. Elephants (panel)
4. Airplane (garage doors)
5. Owl (tree stump)
6. Turkeys (panels)

Now it's time to get to business!

This fall, much of my time is going to need to be split between painting and writing. As such, tonight, instead of writing anything, I ended up working on a commission design for a lady's family tree that she wants painted on her living room wall. She gave me this paper that was actually scraps of paper all taped together with her tree design on it. Tons of these little connections and branches with little letters on each branch. One side of the tree was all good, seeming to fan out in an even way. The other side, taped together on a separate sheet of paper, was stretched out more horizontal, insane compared to the other side. My task was to redraw it, without missing any of the branches, so that both sides looked about even.

It wasn't easy but I did it. But since I was watching a nonstop stream of Under the Dome while I did it, I'm not going to charge her for this part of the project.

I anticipate this being fairly easy to get done, now that the drawing is out of the way. We're going to put leaves down first, since they'll go behind the branches so that she can write in family names and such where they go. Then painting the branches shouldn't be too troublesome. I did something similar, texturally, with the buck and bull's antlers in the two garage door commissions.

So, that'll probably end up being the same technique I'll use. It'll just be time consuming to get each little branch done that way and very monotonous. But this commission isn't happening until October because of scheduling, so, that's going on the back burner for now. I'm just glad that I was able to get that out of the way.

Something I'll probably end up doing in the next few weeks is working on the owl because the tree stump it is going to be on is outside and I want to capture as much of the remaining good weather as I can.

Already this makes me excited and inspired because just the way that the thing is set up looks like owl's spread wings to me. It will be such a glorious challenge to make the bird look animated and in flight and I cannot wait. The turkey I was working on this past spring was torturous trying to get the feathers just right, so, I can't imagine how an owl's feathers will end up being.

Tuesday, August 30, 2016

August Movie Reviews

Mini movie reviews for August. Not very many since I've been writing a lot this month.

Watched We're Back! Ah, childhood memories. Although some of the artwork is just a little rusty, as far as storytelling and direction goes, this is a masterpiece. The voice acting is superb, the character tropes and archetypes are solid, and the musical numbers are fun and catchy. Although a simplified plot made for little kids to enjoy(the dichotomy of the brain gain cereal and brain drain pills, and the wish and fright radios, brothers on opposing side of the fence "New Eyes" and "Screw Eyes") it is apt for the messages they're trying to convey. I could spend an afternoon slicing through and picking apart the symbolism but suffice it to say that it hits that core of truth and that's why it still stands up. Even with Louie's ridiculous New Yorkisms and 80's hairdo.

Just finished Deep Dark and I cannot gush enough about this film. It's not "scary" but it's definitely creepy and unsettling. I feel like similar ground has been covered before with films like with Comforting Skin(which was horrible) and May(2002) but I also feel like the themes and artful metaphors are handled so much more aptly. An artist looking for Muse in a talking hole in the wall. So much of it is symbolically perfect, from the innocuous nature of the origin of inspiration itself, often finding us in a ball of lint or striking us down with the taste of a fruit we haven't had before, right down to the intimate relationship Hermann eventually develops with the hole, mimicking the trope of a Muse being a lover to the artist. The clingy, passive aggressive relationship is also a lot more fitting than the other movies I mentioned because creativity and inspiration can so often be isolating, especially once you tap into the vein you struggle so hard to connect to, it keeps bugging you, nagging at the back of your head for attention, even as you want to glorify and find validation in an audience. You feel pulled in two conflicting directions.

At first, I found the little baubles that Hermann pulls from the hole to be weird but then again, it strikes me as perfect. Encapsulating the organic nature of truly moving art, he incorporates these organ-like pieces of flesh into his mobiles, putting parts of himself(his Muse in the hole) into the works he's creating. Despite the trailer, there wasn't very much gore in this, not what I expected, although the hole does hurt people. I also really liked the theme of dismemberment as a catalyst for freedom, to give up responsibility to the mode of creation by relinquishing access to the creating limbs.

Just finished watching Little Monsters. One of my absolute favorite childhood films of all time. I love the concept, I love the story, and I love the makeup and effects. It's one of those that is rock solid 80's, Fred Savage and Howie Mandel at their prime delivering so much chemistry and bro love on screen that you really feel it at the end. I remember watching this at a young age and having a super crush on Maurice, the monster and I remember feeling sort of disappointed by Howie's revelation in later years that he hated making the movie because the extensive makeup aggravated his OCD and germaphobia. A great adventure movie would 10/10 recommend if you're looking for a fun time.

Watched Pathology and Stir of Echoes. Two very smart thriller type horror films and some of my favorites for their male casting. When I first watched Pathology, I thought both Milo Ventimiglia and Michael Weston were unattractive but after the first 20 minutes of the film, they grow on you. Especially with Jake's first scenes of camaraderie where he actually reveals a bit of fun personality. The best way to describe this film for me is: porn. Basically porn. Story is engaging, entertaining, absurd but takes the hit and faces it head on without a flinch. Drugs, murder, psychopathy, and a "game" spiraling wildly out of control. My favorite thing about it is the dark male characters though. I love the shit out of Jake, especially as his personality starts to evolve and he shows this more twisted side of himself.

 After I finished that porn...I watched some more with Kevin Bacon leading the story in Stir of Echoes. XD I cannot gush enough about this movie. As far as ghost stories go, it follows its own rules and there isn't a wasted line or a wasted scene. Even having watched it several times before, this time around, looking for anything that kind of felt out of place or didn't need to be there, I can't say there is. And it's super simple too. No gimicks, no overused tropes flailing about the scenery; it all feels very genuine, integral to the over all story, and new. That "awakening inner sight" thing they used again for the Insidious franchise(another great series of horror films that bring something new and inventive to the storytelling table!) but I hadn't really seen it before this movie. And don't get me started on 90's Kevin Bacon. Sweet Keksjar, I kid you not, 90's Bacon is my ideal man: slender, angular, wiry muscles, little bit of scruff, cynical grin, smokey voice, and heavy, American accent(what is that? His bio says he grew up in Philly but it feels almost Boston to me). It's the fun and beautiful kind of character to write too, the one he plays in this movie. I could go on for days about all the little manly things he does that just flick that switch for me.

Favorite scene:  Where he's digging in the yard and his wife confronts him about him acting so freaky. He tells her that he's digging for the body of the ghost girl who's haunting him, "feeling" that it's somewhere on their property. The wife glances over at their son who was previously designated as "helping" and Bacon shrugs off her mortification about the 4-5 year old boy helping with this task by giving her a shrug and shake of his head saying, "Don't worry. It's not over there(where the boy is digging in a different part of the yard)." It's just like, "perfect" delivery, great joke to indicate without too many words the state of mind that Bacon's character is in, his fixation with this haunting, and I love the shrug and look he has on at that moment, like "Tch, silly kid 'thinks' he's helping."

Adding a section to this called "Movies to See" which is for already released films that I intend to watch, my own personal list. These will not necessarily be new films but just movies I've got the urge to see. Sometimes, when searching for a movie to watch, my mind draws a blank of what I've recently been craving. This is a spot for those films to be listed as well.

The Darkness Starring Kevin Bacon, Radha Mitchell, and David Mazouz(Bruce Wayne in Gotham). Although there are certain things that make me hesitant about this, like the ending of the trailer where the hand prints cover the wall and cover the girl being sorta cringey, and the reviews for this being very poor, it feels right up my alley. Not only am I a huge fan of the three main actors I just listed but the dark prints, the corrupting influence, the black drool/vomit, and the creepy kid are all tropes that I am attracted to in stories. So, it looks worth the venture even going into it knowing some of it might end up being weak.

Equals Starring Kristen Stewart and, come a long way from his About a Boy dorkiness, Nicholas Hoult! This looks good and I think it surprisingly apt that they found a role for Stewart where acting emotionless and subtly emotional might work in her favor, lol. All that aside, it looks like a really compelling romance, like the civilian side of Equilibrium. Also it looks to be the film version of Nero's "Promises" music video, released all the way back in 2011. Watching that vid way back when, I remember thinking, "I'd so watch this if they made it a movie" and pretty soon I will!

 Swiss Army Man with Daniel Radcliffe. I watched the review by my favorite movie reviewer, Chris Stuckman(GET STUCKMANIZED!! Swiss Army Man Review) and it really makes me want to see it. I'm not sure if you guys know this about me yet, but I'm pretty alright with spoilers. I like to watch trailers and reviews and analysises and theories and go through the tv tropes pages for shows and movies I'm sometimes thinking about seeing. Like, usually I do it with books because I am super picky about putting time and money into a book and I often go through phases where I obsess about certain themes. But sometimes, I do it for movies too. Usually, if it's free/cheap and it's right there, I watch the trailer and then just dive right into it, if it gives me a good vibe. But a lot of times I research a bit more, like with the upcoming Suicide Squad, where the first trailers made me feel conflicted, I read negative and positive reviews, I watched fact videos about the film, analyses about the new backstory revealed in recent years about the Joker actually being 3 people over the years; all things to sort of acclimatize myself to preparing for enjoying this experience a little more. I used to shun films that looked dumb or overhyped to me and after many years and the hype died down, secretly watched them and became a huge fan(can't think of any off the top of my head but there have been a few where I was like, "I wish I'd been a fan sooner rather than a stubborn dummy"). I've also been doing this acclimatizing to myself with the new Ghostbusters movie.

So, Swiss Army Man looks good from Stuckmann's review and even though I brought up this huge explanation for my spoiling myself on films, I actually hadn't even heard of this film until I watched the review.

Midnight Special - this looks super good! I've adored Michael Shannon ever since I was completely spellbound by him in Bugs(which, btw, that is one of those movies that over the years I've felt a craving to rewatch but keep on chickening out because I remember the parts of self mutilation him and Judd engaged in was so cringeworthy, like, nailing that body response of flinching so perfectly that now, all these years later, I still feel incapable of putting myself through that again). This looks like a good supernatural drama and very interesting concept with the boy's powers and the religious aspect as well.

Blood Father It just came out recently and I'm linking the review by Chris Stuckmann because my main motivation for putting it here IS his review of it. I'm an old school Mel Gibson fan and I loved his work in The Beaver in recent years, so, I'm kind of excited to see him doing movie roles again. Or at least starring in something that might remotely interest me.

Southland Tales lol, this actually came up during a WatchMojo video for "movies that ruined director's reputations". But the sequence I linked actually has me so excited about it. Not just because I love the Killers but also because it's so strange and full of that cartoonish, hyper-masculinity that I love. The bloody shirt, the scarred face, the guy's eyes, his hair, his facial hair, the way he sticks out his tongue, that little smirk, grabbing ladies, etc. etc. ffs gimme gimme! Justin Timberlake does not look like himself, more meaty in this, and even though it appears he features with a minimal amount of screen time, I don't care. the trailer looks zany and off its rocker too.